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  • Are our textbooks and education system in general getting obsolete?

    Rucha Wankhede

    Member

    Updated: Oct 26, 2024
    Views: 1.6K
    Everyone one of us at some point during our academic ventures must have asked this question to ourselves.
    With the advent of age of information and technology which changes every passing second,we wonder, does our present education system ill equip us with the knowledge that it imparts. Much emphasis seems to be given on method of rote learning with little encouragement for experimental studies or research work.
    Will this help us in the long run? Or are we still learning what has already been out of practice worldwide 20-30,years back? Is there a need to revamp the whole syllabus of courses and the overall functioning?
    There's a saying that goes- Education isn't filling of a pail but the lighting of the fire. Our present system of learning hardly seems to be promoting that.
    If there's difference between literate and educated,where does our system fit in?
    Education isn't supposed to be a job-fetching exercise,its supposed to be learning experience which should be enjoyed rather than feeling burdened about.
    To add to the miseries none of the finest instituitions of our country have been ranked in the top 50 universities of the world. What are the implications of this? And for how long are we going to carry on the same old way which clearly doesn't seem to be working anymore in our favour.
    Does our system fulfill its responsibility of building up a foundation for an all round youth of globalized world or do we need to introspect and change our ways before its too late?
    Questions are too many answers too few.
    Would like to know what you people think about it.Do post your take😀
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  • Jeffrey Arulraj

    Member • Feb 19, 2015

    Mate,

    1. The syllabus and all the other stuff is fine but one think I find really low is the examination pattern, Most of the universities have repeated questions in their final exams. Its just that the student prefers to slog with a question Bank than with his or her book. At the same time the questions asked in the exams are also not application oriented, They just test how much stuff you have mugged up the previous right.
    2. Next, The preference of low sub standard text books by the student. All books used by the students are not up to the global standard. You must know that some of the books used by the students are clearly intended to clear your exam than to give you stuff
    Education is a way to ignite the first flame, Its is upto the student to realise his passion and pursue it.

    PS: If you are not able to comprehend the thing that came out 20/ 30 years back, What confidence does it give that you will learn today's tech.
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  • Rucha Wankhede

    Member • Feb 22, 2015

    There are two things,one learn and know the fundamentals or the base to know the updated knowledge and two to build upon this knowledge to expand or grow further. By referring to the knowledge that goes 20-30 years back,I meant the updates or upgradations,which keep on transitioning every few years or maybe months.
    Secondly we have to take into consideration the advent or spread of internet and web information technology.When everything is available at the click of mouse does it make sense to rote learn? Wouldn't we be better off investing and using our faculties into some other way of knowledge or research or innovating?
    As Einstein once put it- Education is not the learning of the facts,but the training of mind to think.
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  • Shashank Moghe

    Member • Feb 23, 2015

    Recluse
    .When everything is available at the click of mouse does it make sense to rote learn? Wouldn't we be better off investing and using our faculties into some other way of knowledge or research or innovating?
    A lot of garbage is also available on the internet at the click of a button. One needs to have a sound fundamental understanding of the "search phrase" before one can expect to understand what the click of the mouse gives you in "results". One needs to have the filter to differentiate useful information from garbage. That is what the education system is for- paving the way for fundamentals of knowledge. Internet is for when you have the eye.


    Recluse
    As Einstein once put it- Education is not the learning of the facts,but the training of mind to think.
    A mind without the basic knowledge can only contemplate as much. You first need to know what can qualify and what can't - otherwise all you have is a daydream. If you want to "conclude", you needs rock solid basics. Bottomline - you cannot train a mind unless it has something to build upon.

    #-Link-Snipped-# has hit a nail on the coffin.
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  • Anoop Kumar

    Member • Feb 23, 2015

    There are lots of thing you have covered in OP.

    Textbook are way to generalize what a student *should learn at particular age. It doesn't limit a student to explore more.
    Yes, textbook needs to updated at time to time.

    I think there is loophole is evaluating a student at end of the year. Which making student to just memorize and how well you can answer the paper question rather than actually learning and applying the knowledge.
    Evaluation should on regular basis, what a student learn. It may be granular to every 2-3 month or even at monthly basis.

    Scrapping book and giving a tab in hand is not a answer.
    The following strip make a "little" sense in this context.
    Imagine a situation of a 7th grade student in computer class with everyone on with a tab in hand keep asking a counter question.

    abstraction
    Yes, as a student they have every right to ask questions. But it is also true that they can't understand everything.

    Recluse
    Education isn't supposed to be a job-fetching exercise,its supposed to be learning experience which should be enjoyed rather than feeling burdened about
    Agree with this, upto to 12 totally forced to score more and more percentage. And after that no idea what to do then, get a degree for a job, and even though degree in something else and job in something else.
    System is even paralyse in creating skill set.
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  • Jeffrey Arulraj

    Member • Feb 23, 2015

    Recluse
    Secondly we have to take into consideration the advent or spread of internet and web information technology.When everything is available at the click of mouse does it make sense to rote learn? Wouldn't we be better off investing and using our faculties into some other way of knowledge or research or innovating?
    Roting is invented to satiate the evaluators as the others pointed. But roting is not imposed on all of us. We have the right to rote or learn a thing as it has to be learnt.

    It is our choice and many "So Called Engineers" fail miserably in this step.

    One question that struck my mind "What is the age gap between you and your faculty?"
    If this gap is very less, then there is a very high chance that the staff also came up through rote learning.

    Anoop Kumar
    System is even paralyse in creating skill set.
    Sir, System is better left alone. Where is the brain of the student? Doesn't he/she need the thirst for skills.

    We have many Engineers in our society thanks to our system. But how many of them are skilled Engineers? This is a rhetoric question posted in many reputed firm's recruitment drives.
    PS: I am not against any staff. I also dream of becoming one.
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  • Mr.Don

    Member • Feb 25, 2015

    Education will never become Obsolete. It's the execution of one's education; that will, definitely. Yes. Please, don't blame the system CEans. Nobody has nothing to do with it. In-fact, there was no specific system when all this came into existence. It's the personal self-esteem towards interests of a person with ratio(selfless:selfish) attitude that matters here. When a persons interests are optional then that persons goal will be directionless. Here, everything is Obsolete.
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  • Rucha Wankhede

    Member • Feb 27, 2015

    You first need to know what can qualify and what can't - otherwise all you have is a daydream. If you want to "conclude", you needs rock solid basics. Bottomline - you cannot train a mind unless it has something to build upon.

    There are n number of examples to quote and prove what an untrained mind without any formal education to build on has achieved,on the basis of just imagination,instinct and curiosity . Most scientists and discoveries of serendipity fall in this category. Because the answers you look for are mostly not found in the degrees you pile. And by education I mean here higher secondary and professional education,the question is about the system and practices we follow,are they getting redundant? The question is not about whether to abolish the system completely, its about, is it doing fine or do we need to introspect and go for a change or upgradations?
    I think the whole way or perspective by which education is looked at and perceived and practiced in country needs a rebooting.
    The learning of those very, rock solid basics, you talk about,are somewhere lost in the race of marks,grades undue importance on examinations and evaluation.

    We have the right to rote or learn a thing as it has to be learnt.

    True.But don't you have to go through the same system of education to be an engineer?Pass the exams same way,rote learning,to get a score. Ofcourse passionate and dedicated people learn too but why this double duty,will there be any need to rote learn if you just understand the thing? It will automatically be ingrained. But then if you write your exam understanding the things and the 'length' of your answer shortens in the course you don't score as much. So you just can't do away with rote learning. And here's the catch.
    I think its the failure of the system which judges you on how much you know than caring about how much you have imbibed.
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  • Shashank Moghe

    Member • Feb 27, 2015

    Recluse
    There are n number of examples to quote and prove what an untrained mind without any formal education to build on has achieved,on the basis of just imagination,instinct and curiosity . Most scientists and discoveries of serendipity fall in this category. Because the answers you look for are mostly not found in the degrees you pile.
    So you are insisting on the off chance that serendipitously you will strike the golden jackpot and discover something? Leaving something to chance when you have the tools to train, is something I find utterly wasteful.

    Besides, imagination, curiosity and instinct can only get you so far- to build on that initial spark and to bloom it into a full fledged burning fire, you need the tools. You cannot do much without those tools. Something, sure, but not much. Thousands of apples must have fallen on people's heads before one fell by Newton, and nobody decided to give that punishing apple a second look, but Newton, because he knew how to proceed beyond the instantaneous pain.

    I never rote learn, I scored pathetically in my engineering days, but I would say I do not regret being the university topper, not getting placed on campus or working in a MNC. I can proudly say that because I could not rote learn, I had to take the more rewarding way - of understanding concepts , that I am good with my understanding of my field and what I do today. Rote learning is a choice, never a compulsion.
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  • Rucha Wankhede

    Member • Feb 27, 2015

    Its just the way you look at things. To my mind hundreds of learned men maybe more learned than Newton must have observed the phenomenon, but it was Newton alone who questioned because he had an imagination and curiosity to question a seemingly ordinary thing.
    Einstein never sat through classes to gather the tools as you say and then arrive at the theory of relativity. His imagination was independent of education. Imagination is more important than knowledge is what he observed.
    If you have that, education or no education ,doesn't matter much but if you have only education and no imagination you are drowned.
    Not everybody probably gets as lucky as you to not rote learn and still pass through. I was speaking of generality not exceptions.
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  • Shashank Moghe

    Member • Feb 27, 2015

    Recluse
    To my mind hundreds of learned men maybe more learned than Newton must have observed the phenomenon, but it was Newton alone who questioned because he had an imagination and curiosity to question a seemingly ordinary thing.
    "May be" is speculative, hence holds no substance. I would rather this discussion be concentrated on facts than on speculations. Newton was able to imagine and build upon the observed phenomenon because he knew what tools to apply to his observations. Without them, he would be one of those who would think that God punished him with an apple.

    Recluse
    Einstein never sat through classes to gather the tools as you say and then arrive at the theory of relativity.
    A very gross misunderstanding!! Here, I copy/paste Wikipedia:

    Albert Einstein was born in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulm" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Ulm</a>, in the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_W%C3%BCrttemberg" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Kingdom Of W%C3%Bcrttemberg</a> in the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_Empire" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">German Empire</a> on 14 March 1879.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-Bio-14" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Bio 14</a> His parents were <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermann_Einstein" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Hermann Einstein</a>, a salesman and engineer, and <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pauline_Koch" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Pauline Koch</a>. In 1880, the family moved to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Munich" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Munich</a>, where his father and his uncle founded Elektrotechnische Fabrik J. Einstein & Cie, a company that manufactured electrical equipment based on <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Direct_current" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Direct current - Wikipedia</a>.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-Bio-14" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Bio 14</a>
    The Einsteins were non-observant     <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashkenazi_Jews" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Ashkenazi Jews</a>. Albert attended a <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic_school" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Catholic School</a> from the age of 5 for three years. At the age of 8, he was transferred to the Luitpold Gymnasium (now known as the Albert Einstein Gymnasium), where he received advanced primary and secondary school education until he left Germany seven years later.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-Stachel2002-15" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Stachel2002 15</a> Contrary to popular suggestions that he had struggled with early speech difficulties, the Albert Einstein Archives indicate he excelled at the first school that he attended.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-archives-16" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Archives 16</a> He was right-handed;<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-archives-16" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Archives 16</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-17" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 17</a> there appears to be no evidence for the widespread popular belief<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-18" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 18</a> that he was left-handed.
    His father once showed him a pocket compass; Einstein realized that there must be something causing the needle to move, despite the apparent "empty space".<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-19" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 19</a> As he grew, Einstein built models and mechanical devices for fun and began to show a talent for mathematics.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-Bio-14" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Bio 14</a> <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-23" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 23</a>
    In 1894, his father's company failed: direct current (DC) lost the     <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_of_Currents" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">War Of Currents</a> to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternating_current" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Alternating current - Wikipedia</a> (AC). In search of business, the Einstein family moved to Italy, first to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Milan" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Milan</a> and then, a few months later, to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pavia" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Pavia</a>. When the family moved to Pavia, Einstein stayed in Munich to finish his studies at the Luitpold Gymnasium. His father intended for him to pursue <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrical_engineering" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Electrical Engineering</a>, but Einstein clashed with authorities and resented the school's regimen and teaching method. He later wrote that the spirit of learning and creative thought were lost in strict <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rote_learning" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Rote Learning</a>. At the end of December 1894, he travelled to Italy to join his family in Pavia, convincing the school to let him go by using a doctor's note.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-24" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 24</a> It was during his time in Italy that he wrote a short essay with the title "On the Investigation of the State of the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aether_theories" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Aether Theories</a> in a Magnetic Field.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-FOOTNOTEStachel2008vol._1_.281987.29.2C_doc._5-25" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Footnotestachel2008Vol. 1 .281987.29.2C Doc. 5 25</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-26" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 26</a>
    In 1895, at the age of 16, Einstein sat the entrance examinations for the     <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ETH" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Eth</a> in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z%C3%BCrich" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Z%C3%Bcrich</a> (later the Eidgenössische Technische Hochschule ETH). He failed to reach the required standard in the general part of the examination,<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-FOOTNOTEStachel2008vol._1_.281987.29.2C_p._11-27" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Footnotestachel2008Vol. 1 .281987.29.2C P. 11 27</a> but obtained exceptional grades in physics and mathematics.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-28" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 28</a> On the advice of the principal of the Polytechnic, he attended the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aargau" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Aargau</a> cantonal school (<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gymnasium_(school)" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Gymnasium (School)</a>) in <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aarau" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Aarau</a>, Switzerland, in 1895–96 to complete his secondary schooling. While lodging with the family of Professor #-Link-Snipped-#, he fell in love with Winteler's daughter, Marie. (Albert's sister <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maja_Einstein" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Maja Einstein</a> later married Wintelers' son Paul.)<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-FOOTNOTEHighfieldCarter199321.2C_31.2C_56.E2.80.9357-29" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Footnotehighfieldcarter199321.2C 31.2C 56.E2.80.9357 29</a> In January 1896, with his father's approval, he renounced his <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_citizenship" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">German Citizenship</a> to avoid <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_in_Germany" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Conscription In Germany</a>.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-30" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 30</a> In September 1896, he passed the Swiss <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matura" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Matura</a> with mostly good grades, including a top grade of 6 in physics and mathematical subjects, on a scale of 1–6.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-FOOTNOTEStachel2008vol._1_.281987.29.2C_docs._21.E2.80.9327-31" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Footnotestachel2008Vol. 1 .281987.29.2C Docs. 21.E2.80.9327 31</a> Though only 17, he enrolled in the four-year mathematics and physics teaching diploma program at the Zürich Polytechnic. Marie Winteler moved to <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olsberg,_Aargau" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Olsberg, Aargau</a>, Switzerland for a teaching post.
    Einstein's future wife,     <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mileva_Mari%C4%87" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Mileva Mari%C4%87</a>, also enrolled at the Polytechnic that same year. She was the only woman among the six students in the mathematics and physics section of the teaching diploma course. Over the next few years, Einstein and Marić's friendship developed into romance, and they read books together on extra-curricular physics in which Einstein was taking an increasing interest. In 1900, Einstein was awarded the Zürich Polytechnic teaching diploma, but Marić failed the examination with a poor grade in the mathematics component, theory of functions.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-FOOTNOTEStachel2008vol._1_.281987.29.2C_doc._67-32" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note Footnotestachel2008Vol. 1 .281987.29.2C Doc. 67 32</a> There have been claims that Marić collaborated with Einstein on his celebrated 1905 papers,<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-33" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 33</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-34" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 34</a> but historians of physics who have studied the issue find no evidence that she made any substantive contributions.<a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-35" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 35</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-36" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 36</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-37" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 37</a><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albert_Einstein#cite_note-38" target="_blank" rel="nofollow noopener noreferrer">Albert Einstein Cite Note 38</a>


    Einstein was formally educated. Although, he was not the run-of-the-mill physicist, his imagination was more powerful than most. His education was, I would say, "augmented" by his imagination. And hence, his quote on imagination versus education. He did not, as no learned man would, weigh imagination as the only ingredient.

    If you read any material on Relativity, you would understand that the Math he used, is not possibly graspable with pedestrian curiosity and imagination, at least not at the age at which he did. It needs a dedicated, sequential and formal education.
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  • Rucha Wankhede

    Member • Mar 9, 2015

    The debate isn't about formal education versus imagination. Or to prove what prevails over what. The present or the current system whether or not needs an overhaul is the question in concern.
    I think it does. Big time.
    It's better if we stick to the subject and don't take it personally.
    P.s On personal note, I happen to have read and studied relativity thoroughly including Einstein's life. Was my state level science talk topic.
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  • Shashank Moghe

    Member • Mar 9, 2015

    Well, you studied Relativity but missed Einstein's life facts there. I got instigated because that point was the basis of your argument (as is for most people arguing with that same misconception). And you cropped the issue of imagination versus education. I just substantiated my counterpoint with proof. This is not making it personal, it is justifying one's stand in a debate.

    Recluse
    I think it does. Big time.
    An assertion does not cut it. Else all debates would have wrapped up in one statement from each of the participants.
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