Challenging the present technology to redesign and reuse the past technology! - Why?

Replies

• 

  Kaustubh Katdare

  All I'm saying for now is #superlike!
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  Well nice idea and thought ATF In short we developed old technology till we couldn't further upgrade it
  
  Consider the Si Semiconductors They have reached the saturation level now and if you want to overclock or modify them above the existing speed then you need a completely newer mineral which exhibits almost all the properties of Si and allows further upgradation
  
  That is actually when a tech gets outdated
  
  Today P4 got outdated as the responses given by IDE and SATA where levels apart. Such a gap can't be updated easily and so we crash'em out as waste
  
  Till we reach saturation level we always tend to use the same old technology as much as possible and upgrade it more and more
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Conqueror

  Till we reach saturation level we always tend to use the same old technology as much as possible and upgrade it more and more

  We might have not researched on the possibilities yet. And I understand when a P4 or Hard disk can't be reused. But why not phones? Every form of modification is possible with the old body I believe. When the first touchphones came up to the market, people were skeptical about it. But once it became a trend then people started liking and wanting one. In the current scenario we've had too much of smart touch phones that deep within atleast most of us long for the old models. A trend setter is hard, but if it can work with any model of automobile, then why not with an electronic device? Wouldn't it be classic to have an old CRT like LED television sitting in your living room, a grandfather clock that speaks time and a radio that looks 50 years old but sounds like an altec lansing or jbl. I really love how they've gestured the reuse of old hi-fi systems when they created that big boombox in the movie 'Step Up 3'.
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  Phone's kernal are meant to support a simple task nothing much
  
  If any device has a processor and if you want to modify the hardware with which it was supposed to operate. Then a new OS has to be designed from scratch
  
  Well this is the only problem, When we already find that this processor is getting outdated and if we further try to modify the existing screens and stuff we end up giving to much load to the processor ruining your processor
  
  I tried to change hardware of a CPU and it failed cause every port in a microprocessor serves a purpose If you by chance want to modify it there is no other go but to rewrite the entire Source code
  
  PS: Source codes for any microprocessor is reserved and not shared in open source Even R-pi played trash in this part
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Conqueror

  Phone's kernal are meant to support a simple task nothing much
  
  If any device has a processor and if you want to modify the hardware with which it was supposed to operate. Then a new OS has to be designed from scratch
  
  Well this is the only problem, When we already find that this processor is getting outdated and if we further try to modify the existing screens and stuff we end up giving to much load to the processor ruining your processor
  
  I tried to change hardware of a CPU and it failed cause every port in a microprocessor serves a purpose If you by chance want to modify it there is no other go but to rewrite the entire Source code
  
  PS: Source codes for any microprocessor is reserved and not shared in open source Even R-pi played trash in this part

  Modify only what is possible. Tweak the old software. It's basically like creating a new device with the skin of the old. Atleast only a few parts are mostly replaced. The entire point is to not kill the model, but keep it live and running. When you look at the outcome of modification of just one phone, you may feel it's waste. But think of modifying 1lakh such phones. About 60 percent of each phone gets directly reused! Hence save a lot of our resources! I guess companies can do it directly or even amateurs who've a flair with such creativity can build a modified device.
  
  P.S: I'm speaking from theoretical point of view. Points discussed may not seem practical from a begineer point of view; but someone who knows the gameplan can try it out!
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  That is worth trying out in masses Trial and error is the best solution in this scenario I would say When it comes to small devices having almost the same operating condition
  
  But CRT's are I can't imagine a device using nearly 2000 V now a days that makes it more complicated to upgrade into finer specs
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Conqueror

  That is worth trying out in masses Trial and error is the best solution in this scenario I would say When it comes to small devices having almost the same operating condition

  Now you got me!
  
  

  But CRT's are I can't imagine a device using nearly 2000 V now a days that makes it more complicated to upgrade into finer specs

  The ingredient would be LEDs or better techies, but the recipe would still read as CRT - if you know what I mean! The logic may definitely sound weird.
  
  P.S: Any other option you've for making use of old CRT monitor and TV sets? Feel free to go crazy on ideas. Also bring up other devices you'd like to see modified.
• 

  lovebox

  But mobile phones are micro-scale devices while something like a car is a macro-scale machine. I have made a simple observation regarding hardware: More the number of moving parts, easier is the modification.
  I have given more thought to the REDUCE, REUSE, RECYCLE concept till now, but now on I will also add RENOVATE to the list.
• 

  lovebox

  By the way, since the talk is about things that are robust enough to stand the test of time, I could keep away from sharing this with you guys.
  I have been using a TVS Gold keyboard for a few years now. Although, it does not look the sleekest best but I can swear by its quality. Anyone who has used it would know what I mean.
  Any supporters for my view about this particular keyboard? Please share your experiences.
• 

  superfan

  In a way, companies do try to reuse components through their recycling programs.
• 

  Abhishek Rawal

  Here as we focusing on the electronic component i.e Mobile phones, let's concentrate on that gadget only.
  
  If you're thinking of grabbing Nokia 3315 and tweaking it to Samsung Galaxy series, then it's not easy at all. First of all, we have to desolder the old-school processor from the gadget & have to replace it with current ARM processors.
  In Cars, you can simply replace the Engine & it might work,but this ain't car. Just replacing the processor won't do anything. We have to take care of memory,power consumption, I/O interface (sensors,camera,etc connected to the phone) & also the ROM. The old mobile processors had different set of instruction, new ARM has different set of instructions, again a big deal.
  Also, if you don't wanna replace the processor then just adding the I/O addons peripheral won't work, the old processors have limited I/O pins, with limited memory to deal with the components. Also you have to reprogram the existing processor so that you can interface the I/O peripherals.
  Sounds to complex work for me.
  
  However, no companies try to do so, because it's very hard, a time consuming process & still there's no assurance that after spending huge amount of money,time & energy in this, will they get the positive result or not.
  
  Even if this somehow it becomes possible, you won't be able to reach the goal until you get the hands on the embedded chips used by company. You know there are methods in which ICs are fabricated in such a way that it can't be reverse-engineered & thus you cannot copy the architecture.Yeah! piracy happens in this domain too,so few methods are sued to protect the work.
  
  This is an awesome thread, but modifying the old-school embedded electronics device with latest features adding into it sounds inappropriate.Old components used to consume more energy & were not eco-friendly as current gadgets are.
  This could be other reason why we should avoid resurrecting old gadgets.
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Abhishek Rawal

  Here as we focusing on the electronic component i.e Mobile phones, let's concentrate on that gadget only.

  We've not limited the discussion to mobile phones alone. This was just taken as an easier example. Feel free to elaborate on other devices.
  
  

  If you're thinking of grabbing Nokia 3315 and tweaking it to Samsung Galaxy series, then it's not easy at all. First of all, we have to desolder the old-school processor from the gadget & have to replace it with current ARM processors.

  Why not use the concept: 'pick someone of your own size' here? Tweaking a small phone like Nokia 3315 for galaxy series is a dumb concept (atleast till now - but there's the iWatch with its smaller size and components that could fit). You could easily modify the 3315 with the technique used in the latest cheap phones as well. Even though the possibilities sound limited, the challenge is still on and that should drive you. Forget the small phones if they seem a waste of time. I bet the Nokia 6680 and N series are still possible for such modifications.
  
  In short: I should be able to reuse the present versions of smartphones in future; Companies may care about profits, but with the technology and expertise, engineers should be able to resurrect and reuse the past!
  
  

  In Cars, you can simply replace the Engine & it might work,but this ain't car.

  Nope, there's more. Sometimes they replace almost 30% of the whole thing to add that extra cheesiness.
  
  

  Just replacing the processor won't do anything. We have to take care of memory,power consumption, I/O interface (sensors,camera,etc connected to the phone) & also the ROM. The old mobile processors had different set of instruction, new ARM has different set of instructions, again a big deal.
  Also, if you don't wanna replace the processor then just adding the I/O addons peripheral won't work, the old processors have limited I/O pins, with limited memory to deal with the components. Also you have to reprogram the existing processor so that you can interface the I/O peripherals.
  Sounds to complex work for me.
  
  Even if this somehow it becomes possible, you won't be able to reach the goal until you get the hands on the embedded chips used by company. You know there are methods in which ICs are fabricated in such a way that it can't be reverse-engineered & thus you cannot copy the architecture.Yeah! piracy happens in this domain too,so few methods are sued to protect the work.

  Exactly why trial and error method should be implemented. If you can't use a company's processor or component, then create your own. Why should companies have all the fun? Haven't we let them rule our brains a lot already? I'm no expert here, but people with flair and potential should definitely give it a try. What have you to loose?
  
  

  However, no companies try to do so, because it's very hard, a time consuming process & still there's no assurance that after spending huge amount of money,time & energy in this, will they get the positive result or not.

  Henceforth atleast they could bring up 'renovate' option in their devices. But most companies are money minded. They won't think out of the box at times. If you give a mental calculation of the amount of electronic waste that can succumb and cumulate in the future, you'd be shocked at the intensity.
  
  
  

  This is an awesome thread, but modifying the old-school embedded electronics device with latest features adding into it sounds inappropriate.Old components used to consume more energy & were not eco-friendly as current gadgets are.
  This could be other reason why we should avoid resurrecting old gadgets.

  What is counted as 'new' today will be counted as the 'old' of tomorrow. Think likewise'!
  
  P.S: Watch the movie 'Idiocracy' - the concept is alarming with what could possibly go wrong in future!
• 

  Abhishek Rawal

  anoopthefriend

  Exactly why trial and error method should be implemented. If you can't use a company's processor or component, then create your own. Why should companies have all the fun? Haven't we let them rule our brains a lot already? I'm no expert here, but people with flair and potential should definitely give it a try. What have you to loose?

  Big companies like Intel, ARM, AMD are in the silicon industry since last 2-3 decades when the processors/micrcontrollers were just emerged. Since then development in the domain continued. You might be knowing that all three have different architectures.
  
  Now talking about "creating your own processor" : Developing architecture & that too which shouldn't be similar to the current technology (otherwise patents infringement) is not an easy task. (I don't want anything that's easy.) But, it requires equally skilled human resources & more than that financial resources for equipments & skilled workers.
  Writing on the forum about creating the own processor architecture is different story & collecting human as well as financial resources & working on the new architecture for processor is total different story.
  
  I don't understand, how you can do that ? Do you have any idea on how to do it ?
  I mean with technical proof, not just like : "pick N series mobile & modify it to android smartphone". We need the technical proof whether it's possible or not, & how it's possible.
  If you're going to create your own processor, why would i place my processor in the old gadget ? I would rather connect external RAM, ROM, I/O peripherals & make my own device.Why would i bother reviving the old gadget ?
  What's that in old gadget that I want to use it again ? I would rather design my new gadget instead of reviving old gadget, if I am going to architect my own processor.
  
  I don't understand on what basis you're thinking of tweaking the embedded circuits.
  Again, I would say it's good thread for mere debating, practical approach is totally different.
  
  Not being pessimist guy, being a realist & hence projecting the difficulties(at some extent impossible) in practical approach.
• 

  Anand Tamariya

  #-Link-Snipped-# is right. More electronics get miniaturized, more difficult it is to upgrade individual components in the system. Look at computers. Last decade, it was easier to upgrade processor, RAM, optical media etc. Then came laptops. Still you could upgrade some components like memory. But with Tab, you won't even think of opening the chassis.
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  Anand Tamariya

  #-Link-Snipped-# is right. More electronics get miniaturized, more difficult it is to upgrade individual components in the system. Look at computers. Last decade, it was easier to upgrade processor, RAM, optical media etc. Then came laptops. Still you could upgrade some components like memory. But with Tab, you won't even think of opening the chassis.

  In other words If technology gets miniaturised the amount code blocks involved increases that makes even more harder to tweak
  
  But I heard CRT's are used still in some signal analysers yet to find suitable links for it
• 

  Sarathkumar Chandrasekaran

  Our hero anoopthefriend has started a great discussion here and i take previlege to take a part in it.
  1)You said a lot about typewriter-
  It was a mechanical device and it can be reworked without a time limit.Mechanical parts can be easily reworked( from my point of view)
  2)On electronics-If you want to upgrage your pc/phone/tv/radio or anything you like to,you want to upgrade the hardware to support a suitable software.(i am having a galaxy y and if i plan to root to jellybean from gingerbread , my phone will get troubled and trumble to run the upgraded os as it has only 800 Mhz processor).
  So we can use the old panel and new technology to get a classy feel.
  Imagine a old Fort T model having all advanced systems such as ECU,ABS,Temperature control,voice control,etc.
  For this to happen,we have to use new powertrain,engine,technology,etc.
  Only the coverbody remains same.But under the hood reveals the new technology.
• 

  Abhishek Rawal

  CSK AUTO

  i am having a galaxy y and if i plan to root to jellybean from gingerbread , my phone will get troubled and trumble to run the upgraded os as it has only 800 Mhz processor
  So we can use the old panel and new technology to get a classy feel.

  Surprise surprise ! I own Y too 😁
  
  
  
  You just need to port 😉
• 

  lovebox

  While the concept is marvelous, the implementation is a bit less feasible for the moment. The level of miniaturization that we are moving towards is making it far too difficult to take things apart and put them back in order without compromising on the functionality.
  Talking in terms of electronic gadgets, may be the concept can propel us to design more generic type hardware, whereby the user can mix and match the components to create gadgets that suit their requirement, and even upgrade it as per their choice in the future. If this really happens, it will perhaps be an outstanding example of the Great Indian 'Jugaad'.
  But I doubt that this would end up expanding the size of the electronic gadget rather than shrinking it.
  Let's keep thinking in this direction, something extraordinary might pop up if we think deep enough. 😀
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Any other takes on this folks?
  
  Meanwhile an interesting news heard on the radio and also seen here: #-Link-Snipped-# Russia to stop using computers and start using typewriters to stop leaks of data!
• 

  Ashraf HZ

  Interesting idea, but there are some things better left just being recycled instead of "hacked" and reused for its original function. Older electronic can devices contain toxic devices (before the advent of RoHS), so they are better off sent to specialized recycling places to dispose of safely.
  
  We can probably look at what can be removed easily, such as the device casing and perhaps the screens (Nokia LCD screens are notoriously popular to electronic hobbyists).
  
  If the devices is still working (like that old Pentium 3 PC), you can still use it for other things. Install a light Linux installation, or turn it into an Asterisk/firewall box. Heck, install it in your car to realize the dream of an autonomous car. Old laptops are being frequently used for robots as well. If you are not interested in that stuff, at least donate them to others who can still use them.
  
  Electronic companies respond to consumer trends. If people like "thin" objects, they will come out with thin stuff. If we become more "green" conscious, they will come out with more environmentally friendly stuff.
  
  Who knows, perhaps in the future, bio-degradable electronics can come to fruition sooner than later.
• 

  Sarathkumar Chandrasekaran

  We want to use new technology with old retro style.i.e. Create a new car with up to date technologies and with a old classic cover(look,body style).I dont meant to use the same old cover or bodywork.We can use new carbon fibre material but with old look.
  Look : Really matters
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  CSK AUTO

  We want to use new technology with old retro style.i.e. Create a new car with up to date technologies and with a old classic cover(look,body style).I dont meant to use the same old cover or bodywork.We can use new carbon fibre material but with old look.
  Look : Really matters

  
  I don't know but I guess styles keep coming back every decade. There was a 70s style, and now there's a modified 70s style. We people have redesigned and tweaked up the old thick and large spectacles to create that cheesy look which most of the dudes wear these days. Cars definitely add to this lineage. 😒
• 

  Sarathkumar Chandrasekaran

  anoopthefriend

  I don't know but I guess styles keep coming back every decade. There was a 70s style, and now there's a modified 70s style. We people have redesigned and tweaked up the old thick and large spectacles to create that cheesy look which most of the dudes wear these days. Cars definitely add to this lineage. 😒

  I also agree with it but we cant leave great retro's.My love is for Ford mustang gt
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  CSK AUTO

  I also agree with it but we cant leave great retro's.My love is for Ford mustang gt

  Well retro's gain value as time progresses
  
  I think using a electronic print head instead of the mechanical gear head in the type writer is a great solution and it is worth working here in CE labs what you say
• 

  Sarathkumar Chandrasekaran

  Conqueror

  Well retro's gain value as time progresses
  
  I think using a electronic print head instead of the mechanical gear head in the type writer is a great solution and it is worth working here in CE labs what you say

  Yes yes yes.
  I totally agree your honour.
  All external bodies made up of new technologies and with old fashioned style.
  😀
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Conqueror

  Well retro's gain value as time progresses
  
  I think using a electronic print head instead of the mechanical gear head in the type writer is a great solution and it is worth working here in CE labs what you say

  But doesn't electronic item mean we've to use electricity again. The mechanical part in itself was manual and eco friendly. How can you fasten up the mechanical part of the typewriter using modern tech and without using power?
  
  An other option would be to add a manual dynamo mechanism to boost conqueror's electronic print head. What say folks?
• 

  Sarathkumar Chandrasekaran

  anoopthefriend

  But doesn't electronic item mean we've to use electricity again. The mechanical part in itself was manual and eco friendly. How can you fasten up the mechanical part of the typewriter using modern tech and without using power?
  
  An other option would be to add a manual dynamo mechanism to boost conqueror's electronic print head. What say folks?

  No we mean that using old style with new tech.oldfashioned car but under the hood should have a w16 engine.
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  CSK AUTO

  No we mean that using old style with new tech.oldfashioned car but under the hood should have a w16 engine.

  Hey ya mate he is talking about the Electronic type writer not Old car with new engine here
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  anoopthefriend

  But doesn't electronic item mean we've to use electricity again. The mechanical part in itself was manual and eco friendly. How can you fasten up the mechanical part of the typewriter using modern tech and without using power?
  
  An other option would be to add a manual dynamo mechanism to boost conqueror's electronic print head. What say folks?

  Well ideas can be suggested in this thread in CE lab
  Electronic type writers
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Indian Engineer Converts Plastic Into Fuel. Gets Patent!
  👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍👍
  
  We need MORE people like this guy girl!
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  
  
  Loved this concept. Please watch the video to see how a concept has come up to enable a phone that can be used for a long time. Please visit #-Link-Snipped-# and support their campaign.
  
  Tagging @#-Link-Snipped-# to investigate on this and create a sticky thread if possible to support their cause. Watch the video for more info.
  Thanks @Conqueror for the link!
  
  P.S.: This is my 1000th post!
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  anoopthefriend

  Loved this concept. Please watch the video to see how a concept has come up to enable a phone that can be used for a long time. Please visit #-Link-Snipped-# and support their campaign.

  Phonebloks : Watch The Video.
  
  Covered the whole topic
  
  Nice innovations are coming out in the recent times
  
  Reusal of older tech is turning out to be the newer trend
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Now Motorola Project Ara Is Here For Doing To Hardware What Android Did To Software is here! Finally. *Fingers crossed *
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Motorola Collaborates With 3D Systems To Make 'Project Ara' A Reality - might be the answer to customizable electronic circuits. Great!
  
  # Project Ara
• 

  Abhishek Rawal

  It has something to do with Endoskeletons & Modulos, and nothing to do with circuit customization like we discussed in this debate. Customizing already developed circuits (already embedded) is still impossible, but somehow modulos & endo gives us an alternate way to get what we want(Hardware customization).
  
  

  Jeffrey Samuel

  Reusal of older tech is turning out to be the newer trend

  Buddy they ain't using older tech, They're asking hardware manufacturers to develop modulos & endoskeletons which you can just plug&play in upcoming devices by Google+Motorola. It is something like custom-build desktop, like we attach desired peripherals that we want & run the system.
  This is something cool though.
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Not much when it comes to 'technology' wise, but the design perspective is obviously recycling: Hangbags - the paper bag that can be reused as a cloth hanger (watch the video)
  
  
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Another upcoming feat:
  Google's Developer Conference On Project Ara Scheduled On April 15-16
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  
  Update from Are modular phones 'the next big thing' in mobiles?! A stepping stone project to this challenge! Hope more projects come up with similar intent for all our other electronics as well.
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Discarded laptop-batteries could power slums in India
  
  👍👍
• 

  Jeffrey Arulraj

  Too much risk involved if even one of the batteries is to leak due to some technical or human error.
  
  The chemicals in it are even more poisonous than what we know till date
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Project ARA delays: (#-Link-Snipped-#). Do you guys think the phone OEMs are playing some crooked game to make it not work? Even people are skeptical if the product that will be designed will have compatibility issues or not. Nothing is for certain at the moment, only the concept remains alive in our head.
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Recycle Your Waste Paper Into New Ones In The Office Itself With Epson PaperLab
• 

  Anoop Mathew

  Google's Project Ara (PhoneBlocks): World's First Customizable Modular Smartphone's Launch Soon